Wednesday, February 01, 2012

PM Lee : Being poor in Singapore is better than being poor elsewhere!

I really can't believe he said this:

"If you're poor in Singapore, it's no fun, but I think you're less badly off than in any other country in the world, including in the US," - PM Lee in Davos....[Link]

It is an understatement to say he stretched the truth a little. He is not even in the same page ....perhaps not even in the same planet when it comes to what Singaporeans feel on the ground. He actually said that Singapore is the best place to be in if you're poor. If PM Lee believes what he said, he is also saying we are already there when it comes to helping the poor, no need to do much more for the poor in Singapore.

Find me another developed nation, where the poor receives less help from the govt, where public housing for the poor is more expensive, basic utilities like water and elecity cost more relative to wages of the bottom 20%, where there is no minimum wages, where healthcare is less accessible than in Singapore and income gap is bigger than Singapore. Strangely, he said "...including the US" as if the US is the prime example of a country that takes care of the poor - so what are the Occupy Wall Street people protesting? PM Lee forgets places like Finland, Germany, Switzerland, and our own asian neighbors like Taiwan, S. Korea and Japan where the income gap is smaller smaller ....where minimum wage and a universal healthcare system is in place. . Even capitalistic Hong Kong has implemented minium wage and comprehensive welfare so that the poor elderly  woirkers can have a proper retirement....when we still find old folks in Singapore cleaning tables for a living.

PM Lee can't see what ordinary Singaporeans already know....how high is his ivory tower?...It has to be really really far from the ground.

99 comments:

theonion said...

He if noted , he opined, he did not state.
His basis on absolute poverty not on the relative poverty.

Anonymous said...

"PM Lee can't see what ordinary Singaporeans already know....how high is his ivory tower?...It has to be really really far from the ground."

But he is very close to at least 60% of the ground. Isn't that close and good enough by any world standard?

Anonymous said...

Actually he is right. It is ok to be poor in Spore. At least you can ask for some assistance, or if hospitalised, can ask for subsidies.

It is those who are neither rich nor poor that is deadly. You want subsidies in hospitals, they put you under mean testing and most of the time you will not be qualified.

Who can afford a medical bill of a few hundred thousands? Don't ever get sick and not rich or poor.

ser guan said...

If the old folks do not clean table in singapore, then who should clean table?

a) foreign workers
b) graduates in their 20s
c) dirty my own hand by using the hawker centre table towel
d) bring my own towel and tissue paper?
e) young children as young as 10

What is the answer?

Sgcynic said...

At that height, helicopter vision not enough. Satellite Zoom necessary. Worse captain blind. Plane on autopilot

Anonymous said...

Let's prove PM Lee correct.

Let's make him unemployed in GE 2016.

Sgcynic said...

Btw, I guess it myst be "fun" to be rich and in power in Singapore. What about the middle class?

Wer said...

Yes. Lets go be poor in other (better) countries!

Anonymous said...

"It is those who are neither rich nor poor that is deadly."
Anon 1/2/12 15:33

If they are 40% or less, maybe deadly for them, but not for 60% or PAP so if majority is OK, then it is OK.

Anonymous said...

If I were PM Lee I would advise govt of all the democratic countries to ensure that the poor are 40% or less.

Maybe not the Singapore way but find their own way to ensure this.

Once achieved, sure win one.

Anonymous said...

How much can you expect from someone that can say "mee siam mai hum"?

Anonymous said...

He just praise the US a few articles ago suddenly the great lucky tan turns around and mock it. Talk about nitpicking

Mansur Cho said...

Hsien Loong's statement stinks of hubris and ivory tower self indulgence. This is part of Kuan Yew's elite at their worst. They still think that things here are not too bad and that they are better than everyone else, even the world's most powerful nation.

Clear eyed said...

What LHL said had been said some years earlier by his underling Vivian Bala - that Singapore is the best place in the world to be poor because the govt even delivers food to the homes of those who have no food. Same fairy tale crap even though much has happened since Vivian Bala's proven to be false claims - tears have been shed, apologies given, promises made, 1 GRC fell to oppo, 35% president, etc. It would be daft to believe that the deaf frogs are not deaf and are sincere and capable of the reforms they promised.

Anonymous said...

ser guan said...

If the old folks do not clean table in singapore, then who should clean table?

a) foreign workers
b) graduates in their 20s
c) dirty my own hand by using the hawker centre table towel
d) bring my own towel and tissue paper?
e) young children as young as 10

What is the answer?

f) pay additional $2000 for a normal Singaporean to do the job. The most food cost increase by $1 per plate. I hope our citizens will be happy because we want Singapoean First Policy.

Anonymous said...

Don't worry what Cancer Loong says. He will soon die of cancer in 10 years. Old fart will up lorry within 5 years. Just prepare lots of champagne and go about improving your own life.

Anonymous said...

Singaporeans say;
"Being elite in Singapore is better than being elite elsewhere"

Singaporeans are too daft to vote the elites out.

Up your Salary! said...

The Brazilian city of Sao Paulo.

Taxi costs S$1.10 per km
Macdonalds combo meal S$15

That should be the pricing here too
Singapore is not cheap yet, the workers are not paid enough.

Yes, pay the table cleaners S$2000
with overtime.

Once this is done, all other wages can go up:

Poly diploma S$4000
NUS graduate S$6000

This makes more sense.
Then, ministers pay will be relative.

We have been living 'cheap' for too ,long.. char kuay teow at $4
should go up to $10.. then you will understand the Swiss standard.

People will start to behave
People will start to dress up
people will cook more at home
People will turn up at weddings on time.

tc said...

All I can say is that I'd rather retire in a less developed country Malaysia, than in Singapore.

This coming from a born-and-bred in Singapore citizen who has served his full NS and reservist obligations.

You Singaporeans should look to acquire a property in Malaysia.

Anonymous said...

"If you're a minister in Singapore, it's no sacrifice, but I think you're better off than in any other country in the world, including in the US," - the 39.86%, and still growing, in the little red dot.

Anonymous said...

Go to Palm Resort Villas and you an buy a gated and guarded 5000 sqf intermediate terrace at RM 900 000. I'm going to sell my E flat and move there once my kids get married and move to their own homes. The kids can then come over during weekends and golf with me. rgds dt

Anonymous said...

For years before general election 2011,
only overall unemployment rate and resident unemployment rate are released whenever unemployment figures were released.
(Residents =
Singapore Citizens + Permanent Residents)

Last year, after general election 2011,
overall unemployment rate, resident unemployment rate and Singapore Citizens unemployment rate were released when unemployment figures were released.
This was the first time in the history of Singapore when Singapore Citizens unemployment rate was made public.
This showed that Singapore Citizens unemployment rate was available but was not made public in the past.

Today, as reported on the main stream newspapers, only overall unemployment rate is released when unemployment figures are released.

Why is Singapore Citizen unemployment rate not made public now when it is made public last year only?

Is it because Singapore Citizen unemployment rate has rised to a high level that it is too ugly to be made public?

Anonymous said...

In many developed countries customers clear their tables but do not understand why Singaporeans find it so unthinkable.

If customers know they are suppose to clear their own table they would not mess it up in the first place.

Anonymous said...

Ahhh!

The good life! Living in a region filled with people who are struggling to find money!

That means the middle income can have cheap, affordable service like
taxis
maids
cleaners
cooks

As long as there are people seeking money, there will be sufficient competition that will moderate prices. This is the 'growth' politicians talk about!

Do you know what it means when politicians talk about:

Growth?

Many millions of people do not even have the faintest idea!
And when millions of people do not know, its good!

Ahhhh!.. the good life! especially here in Singapore:

Another "lucky country"

( the other being Australia )

Anonymous said...

"Why is Singapore Citizen unemployment rate not made public now when it is made public last year only?"
Anon 1/2/12 23:06

60% give them the mandate whether to make public or not.

So what's the point of asking why?

The Pariah said...

Reminiscent of what Kishore Mahbubani (ex-UN Rep and now Dean of LKY School of Public Policy) said back in 2007: "There are no homeless, destitute or starving people [in Singapore]… Poverty has been eradicated."

That's why Singaporeans can only blame ourselves for being SUCKERS in believing PM Lee HL's so-called "apology" pre-GE 2011.

PM Lee's "apology" was coupled with fudged facts about:

(i) building hospitals but omitting to state that Sengkang Hospital will take 10 years (since shortened to 8); and

(ii) property market run-up started in 2009 when the charts show sharp spike from 2007.


That's why I reckon the 40% of Singaporeans need to work very hard for the next 4 years to convince at least another 20% of the 60% PAP voters.

Anonymous said...

Typical papist style. Telling half-truths and lies to confuse and then control Singaporeans.
Never trust the papist leegime. A bunch of crooks.

Anonymous said...

LHL's statement on the plight of poor in Singapore showed a lack of understanding and empathy of the poor struggle living in a place with ever rising cost of living created by the PAP but does not impact on the life of our millionaire Ministers. If the PAP does not feel that life is a problem for the poor and there is nothing wrong in a country with the widest income gap between the rich and the poor, then they will never make any effort to improve the plight of the poor in Singapore.

Anonymous said...

The "poor" is only less than 0.01%

Wats the problem?
Should I be scared?
Should I be worried?

Who worried for me when I walked 7km home becos I spent 10cents in school to buy food? ( 1965 )

Its always the poor.
Wat about the rich?

Why dont we have a flat income for everyone regardless of skill?
So we will have no poor and no rich and no middle income.

One standard home for all
No landed, no private property
Everyone have cars.. only 1 type.
Everyone goes to the same school

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous: 1/2/12 15:21

Yes, you are right. If you are neither rich nor poor, it is better you die when you are very sick.

I bet most of the 60.1% who voted PAP
belongs to this group- Daft!

Anonymous said...

Just make sure you vote Opposition before you die or emigrate to another country.

Better still, live overseas.
Keep your Singapore citizenship.
Vote Opposition.

Ng Eng Hou said...

With education and health costs keep going up, with those cheap eating and shopping places being tear down in the name of development, how can being poor in Singapore be better than elsewhere ?

Talking Nonsense!

Anonymous said...

pinky is living in a world of his own. Even the Indonesians have minimum wage & they are trying to raise it.Here got superhigh minimum wage for those in ivory towers but no minimum wage for the lower levels.

Anonymous said...

Really sick and tired of people using the 60% to justify LHL, PAP, govt, whatever. Friends, the 60% are either those who have been bought over to who are brainwashed. I know because I belong to the 60% until recently.

Anonymous said...

pinky is living in a world of his own. Even the Indonesians have minimum wage & they are trying to raise it.Here got superhigh minimum wage for those in ivory towers but no minimum wage for the lower levels.

Anonymous said...

Anyone knows if any of those committed suicide at Bedok Reservoir
did so becos they were sick (medically) and cannot afford treatment?

Anonymous said...

When the main stream media is state-controlled, the govt can say ANYTHING it likes without fear of contradiction or challenges.

Logically, the local media must be the prime target. When you bring them down you have got the govt by the balls -to paraphrase Richard Milhouse Nixon.

Anonymous said...

How would PM Lee know what poverty is like whether in Singapore or elsewhere?

Anonymous said...

Suppose two people start out with a million dollars.

Person 1 enjoys life, expensive holidays, cars, houses, etc then runs out of money and when he retires becomes a burden to the state.

Person 2 denies himself the all the luxuries in life, intending to save the money for an independent retirement.

How is it fair that Person 1 should receive state help?
Yet this is the situation a lot of Singaporeans live. Taking 10y loans to buy cars they shouldn't be buying, drinking Starbucks, annual holidays, new phones and gadgets, large screen TV's.... instead of Saving for the inevitable.

I am a saver. I deny myself the luxuries not because I don't enjoy them, but because I don't want to be a future burden to the state.

How can we eliminate the moral hazard of letting spendthrifts be burdens to savers?

Anonymous said...

PM Lee should invite all the poor folks of the world to come to S'pore!!

Anonymous said...

I am sure He may just be joking making that statement so don't take it so seriously

Anonymous said...

@ ANON: 2/2/12 23:32
"How can we eliminate the moral hazard of letting spendthrifts be burdens to savers?"

This is a good question.
Your choice and answer lies in your value system.

Do you make 99 worthy welfare recipients starve just so that you don't allow yourself to be fooled by that one welfare cheat?

OR the other extreme;

Do you let 99 welfare cheats take advantage of you because you don't want to let that one deserving welfare recipient slip through the cracks?

The acceptable solution is probably somewhere in between these 2 extremes.

So question now is whether the Party Against People is an extremist party.

See below hyperlink for the historical significance of the lightning logo.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Union_of_Fascists

Anonymous said...

Can we assume that most of those voters who are poor will not vote PAP?

If so, then to have 60% "not poor" is "not bad".

Because not many countries have majority who are "not poor".

And Singapore is one of the few. And maybe one of the reasons why PAP in power for so long.

Anonymous said...

"PM Lee : Being poor in Singapore is better than being poor elsewhere!"

Agreed. And maybe some of our poor think the same also. Or else PAP may not have got the 60% mandate for PM Lee to say what he said.

The said...

One important point - the poor in the so-called poor countries are able to get by in the countryside where they can plant their own vegetables or raise poultry. They can put up a roof without the authorities clearing them out. Those neither here or there are not caught with high taxes and consumption taxes.

Anonymous said...

When you see the poor from US, Canada, UK, Australia, NZ, Japan, Germany, Sweden, France or any true First World democratic countries coming to Singapore to live, you can then say LHL is correct. So far I have not seen many citizens of other developed countries swapping their passports for Singapore ones. Conversely, I'm aware of many Singaporeans who have taken up citizenship in US, UK, Canada, Australia and NZ. Many more are PRs in those countries.

Anonymous said...

"When you see the poor from US, Canada, UK, Australia, NZ, Japan, Germany, Sweden, France or any true First World democratic countries coming to Singapore to live, you can then say LHL is correct."
Anon 3/2/12 10:25

But they are not talented and also not cheap so cannot come!

We want talented and also cheap ones from China, India, Philippines, Myamar or even Africa, if there is.

Even Singaporeans who are talented but not cheap also don't want them. Or not talented but cheap also don't want.

Must be talented and also cheap!

Anonymous said...

LHL made such wild claim without any supporting facts, statistics or studies.
The poor in Indonesia don't need money at all. His build his own house on government land. Don't have to pay any tax or levy. Grow his own rice and food. No need to pay for electricity or water. Above all he and his family are very happy living an existential life.
The poor in Australia has free medical and government housing. He can also have access to welfare payment of over $1,000 a month. On top of that he can rely on non-government and semi-government welfare organisations.
The poor in Europe has unemployment and welfare support.
So for sure the poor in Indonesia, Australia and Europe are much better off than the poor in Singapore.

Anonymous said...

If I have 60% mandate at elections, I can also make any claim I like.

Because even if people are unhappy, at least 60% will still vote for my party, no matter what.

Anonymous said...

The PM of other countries will dare not make such claims about their poor.

Because

1. They don't have enough mandate to say such things. They can be voted out easily if they say wrong things.

2. The claims are also simply not true.

But not for PM Lee. He has the mandate and also his claims are true.

Anonymous said...

LHL n pap don't have the genuine mandate. GE in Singapore is not fair, free nor democratic.
That is why they dare not allow neutral independent international observers to witness GE in Singapore.
LHL secretly commissioned an Australian consultant to do polling survey which is against the law enacted by the papist Leegime.

Anonymous said...

PM Lee is a lousy leader. Either he has lost touch with the ground, or we have lost touch with the government.

He has become greedy and for him, it's a competition between the haves and the haves more. PM Lee and his team wants more.

On what grounds should government ministers be paid $200 000 per month as opposed to $50 000 a month? What's the justification?

What kind of talent are we attracting? The crooked types or the type of talent who is motivated in public service and calling. Not merely money. What kind of values do our government ministers have?

Values and money have now been contaminated and intermixed and many people are confused.

THey are confusing the issues now.

Are we to say that we are not treating our government ministers well that we need to make them millionaires with our own income tax that we pay each month?

They MORE than well-treated. They're greedy and blind now. No?

Wages are falling in singapore compared to other citizens in the G8 nations and inflation is rising at 5%.

Anonymous said...

I used to be one of the 60% until we bought a hdb flat recently and we realised what was goin on in singapore. We have to be careful. Things will get hader in singapore.

Anonymous said...

I am a Singaporean living in the US for the last 4 years. If you are poor in USA you have medicaid to pay for your hospital bills, if you are retrench you have unemployment benefits and if your family income is less than 23K your gets generous tax refunds as high as 8K. PM LEE is talking nonsense in respect to US.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 10:53

Everyday more people are reading in between the lines and having that aha moment like you did. Just study their leaseback policy...their rental policy... 2 complete strangers together, dun care how you do it but it for your own good. Can you find more kiasu cover backsides policies than those?

Anonymous said...

"Being poor in Singapore is better than being poor elsewhere!"

The village idiot believes in his own bullshit.

Fred. S said...

i am worried for our prime minister. why? he must be suffering from severe mental illness. he is delusional. he needs to be examined by expert mental health experts now. he is so far out of touch of reality judging by recent comments about the poor of singapore being so 'well off'

Anonymous said...

being talented in singapore is better than being talented in elsewhere.

a lot of talented are not so talented in their own countries but are talented in our country. that also includes many half-baked talented sitting in their ivory tower.

Anonymous said...

//he is so far out of touch of reality judging by recent comments about the poor of singapore being so 'well off'//

He is pacifying himself & justifying for the presence of poor. But I do not think that the poor will feel any richer or better by being poor in Singapore after reading his statement.

Anonymous said...

Is it just me or does the government thinks that the main cause of being poor was gambling?

Anonymous said...

//Is it just me or does the government thinks that the main cause of being poor was gambling?//

it could be due to many reasons and losing heavily in gambiling is one of them.

anyone sole breadwinner working as cleaner & security guards (even w/o the gambling) will be poor more or less here given the cost of living here - no matter how hard he or she works.

Anonymous said...

Tan Jee Say's "Heart Beat"

Its an excellent idea. It will help the ISD set up one monitoring centre. So far everytyhing he does is helping the govt. Most pundits have serious policy discussions inviting a variety of people from all walks of life in order to get a range of views. They don't call it an opposition organised events but when you are invited except for the clueless ones, the rest know exactly what is going in. The good points are distilled and lands on the laps of the known critics and reliable opposition figures.

Even the PAP govt hold similar events to gauge sentiments and be better prepared.

Anonymous said...

There is this event organised by Gilbert Goh. Seen this article and maybe some of the readers are interested.
You can find out more by visiting the website
http://www.transitioning.org

----------quoted---------------------
Singaporean First Event at Speakers’ Corner on 11 Feb (Sat) at 5.30pm

Dear Singaporeans,

Transitioning.org will be organising a Singaporean First event at speakers’ corner on 11 Feb (Sat) at 5.30pm.

We will be gathering a group of speakers who will speak their minds on issues that matter to Singaporeans right now.

We still have a slot or two available and if you are keen to speak on that day, please email me at gilbert@transitioning.org by 8 Feb.

We need people to help us design some posters for the event and if you are able to do so, please let me know also.

We will primarily speak against the high influx of foreigners as their presence has affected basic infrastructure resulting in congested malls, over crowded eating places and jam-packed MRT trains.

The general feeling right now for Singaporeans is that the country has being invaded with too many people and the government has always laid the blame on us for not reproducing enough.

Mr Lee Kuan Yew has this to say when he addressed the crowd at Tanjong Pagar GRC and Radin Mas SMC Chinese New Year celebration dinner: “It is a choice Singapore cannot afford to make. Like it or not, unless we have more babies, we need to accept immigrants.” (Today 4 Feb).

Our question to the government is: What have they done so far for Singaporeans to help us reproduce more?

Nothing much actually…besides the baby bonus given to new births amounting to a mere couple of thousand dollars – they have not provide the country with any new ideas so that married couples will readily reproduce.

We all know how meagre our wages have being all along and during the past decade it has only grew a mere 0.3% whereas inflation ploughs on at an average of about 3% yearly.

Couples all love to have children but they know that they can’t afford to have more kids and the government is not ready to offer any tangible assistance.

Moreover, more significantly, foreign talents coming over to work here via the Employment Pass (EP) have competed head on with our local PMETs for jobs.

We also heard from many of our readers that bosses in MNCs tend to hire back their own people for simple jobs like secretaries and administrators – work that Singaporeans can also do.

In some extreme cases, our local workers were squeezed out of the work places by foreigners as ironically they form the minority workers in the work force and faced all sorts of intimidation tactics.

There are also several emails we received highlighting to us that foreigners are paid much more in salary remuneration even when the work duties are the same as the local workers.

This is upsetting as we see our foreign expats earning one of the highest salary package in Asia.

According to HSBC Expat Explorer Survey 2010, 45% of expats earned more than $265, 000 (US$200, 000) in Singapore.

According to the survey report, Singapore is ranked 1st by the proportion of expats who make more $200k USD a year. Bermuda is 2nd with 40% of its expats in the same income bracket. Hong Kong is 3rd with 36%, and Saudi Arabia a close 4th with 35%.

Besides the influx of foreign workers, we also want to speak out against age-bias discriminatory hiring practice which has forced many experienced well-educated PMETs to drive cabs or become property agents in order to ekk out a living.

------continue below----------

Anonymous said...

------continue from above-----

The lack of a proper income for many middle-aged PMETs has indirectly affected marriages here resulting in a sky-high divorce rate.

As many as one in three marriages will result in a divorce.

We want the government to impose certain sanctions on companies who blatantly advertise for younger workers.

Lastly, we also want to speak out against the government’s slogan of paying top dollar for top talent.

We have seen recently how our two ex-chiefs working with SCDF and CNB were broght down in disgrace due to a sex scandal.

We agreed that top civil servants should be adequately compensated but not to a level that allows complacency and eliticism to creep into the system.

If you feel strongly about the mentioned issues, do come out and support our event.

We always believe that Singaporeans should be more united and this is a chance for you to show your solidarity.

We will also only organise such events quarterly now so don’t miss the chance to show to the government how you feel.

Singapore for Singaporeans!

Gilbert Goh

Event organiser

Post Published: 04 February 2012

Anonymous said...

"Nothing much actually…besides the baby bonus given to new births amounting to a mere couple of thousand dollars – they have not provide the country with any new ideas so that married couples will readily reproduce."

Who wants some baby bonus just to have babies. Only half-baked brains will fall for this.

Besides the natural biological urge to procreate, it is the confidence & faith that one has on the country's overall environment that they will factor in to have more babies.

Anonymous said...

"We want the government to impose certain sanctions on companies who blatantly advertise for younger workers."

Our govt seems to be one confused lot. Torn between a pro-business culture which many are taking advantage and the needs of her citizens who could priced out by hard driven foreigners who cannot command the same benefits in their own countries because of cost structures.

Anonymous said...

He has no right to say such things cos he has never been poor in singapore. Singaporeans should be ashamed of their PM and request for his resignation.

Anonymous said...

@ ANON: 2/2/12 23:32
"Suppose two people start out with a million dollars."

Are you thinking like an elite? People here don't start out with a million dollars. Many don't make a million dollar in their entire life.

dream_ozn said...

Though a PAP supporter, i really have to disagree with what PM said.

It's because he has never been poor and does not know what these people goes through and therefore did such a commenting.

This simply goes to show how uninformed he is of the poor people's plight. Just how not familiar he is with the ground.

Being an elitist for his entire life has cause him to be blinded to the various plights of singaproean

cheapest hotels in Singapore said...

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Singapore Classified said...

Yes, I'm totally agree with PM, majority don't make a million dollar in their entire life.

Zee Wu said...

I must first state that I am not a supporter of any political party and I won't comment if the poor in Singapore is better off than other country because I have not been to all countries myself. I would like to get enlightened here.

I like to seek some clarification from the Author why countries like Germany, Hong Kong and Japan have better management of the poor than Singapore?

I have been to all 3 and homeless people are visible on the streets. It is even a recognized problem in Germany.

http://www.shareintl.org/archives/homelessness/hl-abgermany.htm

In Tokyo, there are thousands of homeless people.

Hong Kong's homelessness issue is not as serious but they have their share of social issue among the poor.

Now, would the author care to explain in great detail how the poor in these countries are doing better and bring enlightenment to us?

Green said...

Come on Singaporean, we must stand up!

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Anonymous said...

To be caught in between, you are not rich but not classified to be in the status of poverty, you are in a bad situation.

You are not qualified for the government's subsidies in health.housing,education,transport etc......