Thursday, October 04, 2012

National Conversation goes on in a familiar circle...

The National Conversation started in a broad manner with some tweaks in education in the right direction. Even the radical idea of getting rid of the PSLE was discussed and general agreement that the MOE has to find ways to reduce stress level among parents and students. If there is one redeeming feature in the PAP system, it TV d ;is education. The PAP govt has been willing to spend on this area as an investment - however, in recent years gaps have opened up. Pre-school education quality has become extremely varied, a massive tuition industry draining resources (best experienced teachers) from the system and education has become a high stakes board game sorting students - focussing on selection and amplifying small difference among students. It is good that a frank open discussion about the problems with the system. I welcome the move to eliminate banding of secondary schools and the announcement to educate more students to university level (40%) from a below OECD average of 27%, so that more people have access to better education.

Having evolved the biggest income gap in the developed world, the PAP message now is even if your situation now is bad, your child will have a shot at a better life. Great if a poor parent has a child with an outlier IQ able to overcome the hurdles but not so good a low wage worker whose son gets streamed to normal technical because of poor pre-school, poor language skills and no financial ability to get tutoring. So the message to these people is wait another generation? Maybe your grandson will make it.  When prosperity is not broadly shared, you can't elevate the quality of life of ordinary people. I think most Singaporeasn today understand this and they are waiting for National Conversation to boldly address this issue. But this is not where we are heading in this conversation:

Singaporeans 'accepting of foreigners': Participants of forum with PM Lee
PM Lee talks about population of 6M.
Lim Hng Kiang talks about need for foreigners to generate growth
Minister Tan claims that foreign influx is calibrated
Ex-MM Lee : Singapore cannot do with foreign talent
Foreigners can help anchor new sectors: Minister

Unless you have buried your head in the sand, you should be able to see that the PAP govt is trying to get Singaporeans to accept more foreigners. Without them, the PAP tells us, our economic growth will slow and we will be less competitive. The PAP govt will "calibrate" the numbers. When the govt talks about "calibrated" slower pace of growth it refers to the 34,000 foreign workers excluding domestic helpers in first 6 months of this year or 68,000 annualized. This is roughly double the workforce growth if we count Singaporean joining the workforce. It looks "calibrated" only if we compare with our own numbers in the past but it is still extremely high compared with any other developed country.

The MTI warns of slower growth without the inflow of foreigners. We know that expanding the workforce by importing labor is a sure way to generate economic growth - it is simple maths, the imported labor drives up demand for housing, medical care, attracts investments etc. We also know how such approaches of growing the economy will not lead to desired outcomes for ordinary Singaporeans. Tommy Koh and most economists have said that  such imports have depressed wages[Link] - it is ultimately a transfer of wealth from the lower income to the rich in our society. Is the PAP govt going to do this at a time when we have the largest income gap among developed countries? There are certainly better ways to grow our economy such as moving up the technology ladder, innovation, higher productivity etc but the PAP govt seems determined to import more foreign labor to artificially ramp up the economy.

Even MP Tin Peh Ling has woken up, but the rest of govt is still living in the dark:

“In a way, Singapore has to go into ‘cold-turkey’ after years of allowing huge inflows of foreigners. Politics should be about having the courage to make the best decision at any given point in time, and act on it,”, Tin Peh Ling[Link]

Importing labor to generate economic growth has numerous deleterious effects that Singaporeans are all too familiar with - the relentless rise in cost of living as the demand for necessities like housing and medical care shoots up, the depression of income, and widening of our income gap.

I have been watching this episode involving a group of SMRT bus drivers requesting for help from the NTUC to revolve issues with pay and work load[Link]. Our bus drivers are the among the lowest paid if not the lowest paid bus drivers in the developed world. Bus drivers in Taiwan are paid about twice that of Singapore bus drivers[Link] - this was revealed in parliament by Josephine Teo, Minister of State for Transport. In the US,  a bus driver is paid US$40-50K a year[Link], this is about 3-4 times what our bus drivers are paid and in Scandinavian countries it is even higher. This low income relative to the high cost of living(Singapore is one  of the most expensive cities in the world [Link]) means workers such as these bus drivers face enormous financial strain and have difficulty with housing, medical care and retirement. It was recently announced that these drivers who make gross salary of about $1200 a month were given a salary increase of $225 but it turned out they were badly shortchanged because they were required to work 6 days a week instead 5 days a week.

However, if you look at the situation for bus drivers, there has been a shortage of drivers inn the last few years]Link]. The reason for this is obvious. The pay offered by SMRT is too low to attract drivers and the shortage should have driven up the pay of these drivers to a more reasonable level.  The assertions that "few people want to drive buses" and "bus company have difficulty finding drivers" are just ridiculous. These ridiculous reasons are often told to the public to get them to accept a larger foreign influx. If you go to Germany, Australia and France, they can find drivers for their public buses even though their their populations are better educated (more holding university degrees). The truth is these companies can't recruit because they offer wages that are too low.

"SMRT said it has drivers from Singapore, China and Malaysia, but did not break down the figures.."  - [Link]

The govt solution to this is to allow these companies to keep wages low and recruit from overseas. You can find easily find drivers from developing world countries who will accept these salaries because they come from countries where the cost of living is just a fraction of Singapore's - they can raise their families back home and go back to buy homes after working in Singapore. But we are not just talking about bus drivers but imported labor at all levels in our economy and this has driven wages as a component of GDP down and profits up. Right at the top are a small number people who are richly rewarded based on profits generated rather than actual work.

The unbalanced policies of the PAP has resulted in a 3rd world wage structure in our economy adversely affecting the lives of Singaporeans at all levels. The increase population density also resulted in a cost of living increase that made life tougher for everyone including young graduates:

HDB index Q3 at 96.7
Grad starting pay $2.5k
hdb/grad pay ratio = 39

HDB index Q3 at 198
Grad starting pay $3k
hdb/grad pay ratio = 66

The PAP in the National Conversation says it desires to pursue policies along the same direction to keep the GDP growing and its policies of the last 10 years were essentially correct. Looking further down, it is very clear that these policies will cause Singaporeans' quality of life to deteriorate further and undermine the ability Singaporeans to retire.

After pursuing policies that caused a large segment of the population to struggle from rising cost of living and depressed wages, PM Lee in a recent interview said:

“Singaporeans are not poor, but feel less well-off relative to others in society and that there is a relative sense that they should get an entitlement....

Singaporeans will get help, but the help is not something they are absolutely entitled to...”[Link]

There is no greater sense of entitlement than that among th e people whom we are supposed to be our leaders - they feel they are entitled to the highest salaries in the world for the same job . Yet PM Lee is saying those who have fallen on hard times due to our wage structure resulting from his policies have a sense of entitlement when they need a helping hand. What people want and need are decent wages. Singaporeans want to be paid fairly when they work. His disdainful view of Singaporeans who have suffered due to his policies and are not doing well "feel that they should get an entitlement" says a lot about what he thinks of ordinary Singaporeans and their struggles.


Anonymous said...

Very good observations. There should be a max tenure to the PM if not better change the ruling party so that each party will not be complacent in serving the people.

DanielXX said...

The greatest danger is in leaders who think they are doing best for the people in their policies when they are not. Ordinarily this should have been checked and balanced with a "co-driver". Unfortunately we have not reached this stage.

Kin Lian Tan said...

The situation has become so bad that it is difficult to solve the underlying flaws. It is likely a big ocean liner trying to change its course.
The solution, as Lucky Tan has pointed out repeatedly, is to raise wages.
Small businesses, which are struggling, will find it difficult to cope, but over the longer term, they will have to pay less in rental and more in wages.
It is the transition that have to be managed carefully.

Anonymous said...

"In the long run, we are all dead."
John Maynard Keynes.

Our children cannot tan ku ku, while all the Millionaire Ministers take their own sweet time to learn on-the-job at taxpayers expense.

Can our children's education wait for a finance man to learn how to be a great educator?
.... while chairing a National Conversation spanning a few years?

Anonymous said...

Everyone is really only reading farmer's love stories. That is how boring and useless people think the natconversation is to their lives.

Anonymous said...

"Our children cannot tan ku ku ..."

Not just our children. Our old parents also cannot tan ku ku. They will all be dropping dead like flies in the coming years.

Can't we send our old folks to the Istana for elderly care? Just like the elites.

Anonymous said...

No level playing field for S'poreans. I propose NS, Uniformed services obligations to be outsourced to Blanghadeshis, Gurkhas etc. Politicians & MPs post to foreigners/ex US Presidents etc. If not, lower HDB prices to below 50K. Then we would have a level playing field.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Mr Lucky for a very well analyzed summary on the recent Nat Con.

Everyday, the MSM is trying to brainwashed us to accept more foreigners despite the fact that our public transport and healthcare services are busting their seems.

Our roads are choked every day every hours with vehicles.

It is confirmed that MIW has not woken up yet, the NAT CON is just a monologue, telling us what is best for us. Utterly waste of time and resources.

When i look at the plight of our bus drivers, i feel really sad for the lower wage workers and the voiceless lower educated people.

Is there anyway that concern singaporeans can help ?

We are not xenophobia , but the sheer numbers of foreigners and sheer rate of them coming into this island is mind boggling,

In everything, moderation is the key. Too much of anything is not wise !!

Anonymous said...

Lucky has been blogging since 2005.
Anything got change or not? 60% still vote PAP tio bo? PAP still control more than 90% of the seats in parliament tio bo?

Let's face the facts. You guys just don't know how to get the votes required to form a government.

Michael Ang said...

6 million is just an arbitrary figure, do suspect the actual figure could be higher

Anonymous said...

"His disdainful view of Singaporeans who have suffered due to his policies and are not doing well "feel that they should get an entitlement" says a lot about what he thinks of ordinary Singaporeans and their struggles."

Like father like son... didn't LHL felt he, like his father, were entitled to his ridiculously high salary too? What a hypocrite.

Anonymous said...

Have you heard of the ridiculous price of HDB resale Flats?..Have you heard of sellers asking for $100k cov for places like Bt Merah queenstown and dover?

Something is going to explode or should explode in this society of ours.

The daft 60.1% should be less dumb.

Anonymous said...

No lah. Solution is to vote out PAP.

Anonymous said...

Would the rich/successful come down and sit with the lowly for meals?
Sure, one or two REPRESENTATIVE may do it for national publication and even then, the body is there, the spirit returns to their high society lifestyle.
People don't want to be included in your "program" or take on your IMAGE, people want to be liberated from your....hypocrisy!

Anonymous said...

Having a conversation with people who have made up their minds is like watching a show - the finale is pre-determined.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Lucky has been blogging since 2005.
Anything got change or not? 60% still vote PAP tio bo? PAP still control more than 90% of the seats in parliament tio bo?

Let's face the facts. You guys just don't know how to get the votes required to form a government.

4/10/12 09:46

That's the sorry state of Singaporeans. Stupidity.

Anonymous said...

"We also know how such approaches of growing the economy will not lead to desired outcomes for ordinary Singaporeans."
Lucky Tan

But ordinary Singaporeans are the majority of voters what.

So how come PAP can still get 60% majority votes?

Anonymous said...

Because they follow the stupidity of the elites

Anonymous said...

"But ordinary Singaporeans are the majority of voters what.

So how come PAP can still get 60% majority votes?"
Anon 4/10/12 10:51

This is something that PAP knows and which Lucky Tan doesn't know.

Even the opposition also don't know. And of course Ang Mo experts also don't know.

Maybe in 2016, Lucky Tan may know.

Anonymous said...

MP Tin Peh Ling is probbaly not in the loop of the real power people, so she is not in-sync and is probbaly a slip of her tongue or just another wayang.

Anonymous said...

Only when you know, then you will be confident to achieve the desired outcome (eg winning 93 seats from 60% votes) of what you do.

Anonymous said...

"His disdainful view of Singaporeans who have suffered due to his policies and are not doing well "feel that they should get an entitlement" says a lot about what he thinks of ordinary Singaporeans and their struggles."

Absolutely. Those frogs in their ivory towers have no idea what it's like to be a commoner.

Anonymous said...

"Those frogs in their ivory towers have no idea what it's like to be a commoner."

Yes. But the frogs know how to win 60% of the votes. Something the commoners don't know. And that's why they will always be commoner. Tio bo? It's time you learn to acknowledge your masters.

Anonymous said...

Be patient. The alterntive parties have lost many battles but will eventually win the war. Why?

In the past, all the bad policies and wrong doings were masked by the MSM, TV, radio etc which were totally controlled by the MIW. So they keep winning GEs by big margin.

It is only in GE 2011 that online and social media came into play to balance the views and highlight the fallacies presented by the MIW causing a reasonable amount of vote swing to the opposition.

With a more educated voting population who depends more on online and social media to get information and shape their thinking, there will be further swing of votes. The question is will it be enough for the MIW to be the minority in parliament.

If we want change, we will need to do a lot more to convince voters to change party. The good news is that we have 3 years or more to do so. My personal objective is to convert 10 votes to crossover. What is yours?

Anonymous said...

Sack the papist Leegime. That is the solution to ordinary Singaporeans better future. So long as the papist Leegime is in power extremely high wealth disparity is "NOT IMPORTANT" as per quotation from Lee Kuan Yew.

Anonymous said...

Everyone's waiting for 2016, hoping to vote them out, or at least wrest a couple more GRCs off them which will hopefully be the case. And thus see some change for the better.

Anyone ever thought about how much damage will be done by the PAP hellbent on following its current policies between now and then?

Between the 2006 and 2011 elections, the no of foreigners allowed in grew by about 800,000. Housing has doubled in price. Food has gone up at least 40% generally.
(Hey in the last couple of weeks, so many edible items have risen at least 20%. So yes Tharman, you're right, I, an ordinary Sporean, don't feel 5% inflation. I feel A HECKUVA LOT MORE!)

There are like 30, 40% more people squashed into the trains. There are traffic jams at almost all waking hours. Medical fees have risen substantially. Etc etc etc.

Can you imagine how much more hardship we'll face before 2016.

Should we be waiting till then to change things?

All this between 2 elections.

Anonymous said...

Bottom line is, they are not God. What they say will never be authoritative.

Anonymous said...

"Anyone ever thought about how much damage will be done by the PAP hellbent on following its current policies between now and then?"

Precisely. Damages that will force the inevitable and keep them in power. Daft Singaporeans.

Anonymous said...

Next great movement will be.....Authority. How are you going to establish that?

No current system has achieved that. Think!

Anonymous said...

The less this govt is going to do for the people, the more we are going to give to the opposition parties. I am counting down to the next election for a complete calibration of our parliament sittings. Only than, can we see PAP "suddently" wake up again and say "sorry". Well..too late by then.

Anonymous said...

Like in the wilderness, going round and round and finally returning to its own vomit.

Anonymous said...

Opposition should come up with standard response and arguments to counter PAP propaganda.

Barack Obama is good at mobilising the grassroot and harnessing the power of online media.

The opposition may find may useful points from his campaign to emulate..

Anonymous said...

LKY has already warned us that we shall repent if we do not vote for PAP. Remember his story of how the Japanese will make starve their captors in order to make them more obedient.

Maybe this is PAP's way of revenge on the low & mid income workers who supports the opposition. That is how most cunning politians in power will manipulate their respective government policies to maintain their selfish political interests.

Anonymous said...

Daft Singaporeans deserve to die in hell

Anonymous said...

Look at the number of shopping meals that have sprouted up over the past 5 years. A population of less than 5 million cannot support them all. Without enough people, local or foreign, many retailers and malls will fold. It's a numbers game.

Anonymous said...

Problem After Problem.

Anonymous said...

Good article. Hope more will read it.

Anonymous said...

"ministers follow the civil service rules", can we have a Singaporean National Referendum ?

"Mr Steve Chia Kiah Hong: Clarification from the Minister. Does any serving minister who turns 55 actually receive both salary and pension at the same
time? If yes, should he be serving?

Mr Lee Hsien Loong: I believe the answer is yes. That is the rule for the civil service, and the ministers follow the civil service rules.

(This may be the "rule", but is it morally right?")
(Source: Parliamentary Debates, 2004)" unquote.


Constitution of The Republic Of Singapore

Disqualifications for membership of Parliament

45 - (1) Subject to this Article, a person shall not be qualified to be a Member of Parliament who
(c) holds an office of profit

Penalty for unqualified persons sitting or voting in Parliament

50. (1) Any person who sits or votes in Parliament, knowing or having reasonable ground for knowing that he is not entitled to do so, shall be liable to a penalty not exceeding $200 for each day on which he so sits or votes.

(2) The said penalty shall be recoverable by action in the High Court at the suit of the Attorney-General.

(Singapore: Constitution of The Republic Of Singapore)

(Office of profit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

(Ministers get pensions too -

(TOC News » Pension for ministers – more disclosure, please)

Joshua Chiang

Anonymous said...

PAP holds the majority in parliament.
We can do anything we want.
Change the laws.
Change the constitution.
Appoint & sack the people who interpret the laws and the constitution.
Who is going to stop us?
Tio bo?

Lye Khuen Way said...

Anon 4th Oct 19:19

You sure sound cocksure.

Only problem you seems still not aware of the daily increase in unhappiness.

Oh sure! The huge numbers of Citizenship granted may save the Ruling Party from being wiped off.

Not every new citizen is going to vote blindly.

Anonymous said...

If there is one thing to change in the current education system, that one thing is stop current school teachers from moonlighting.

Current school teachers should devote all their attention, energy and effort to teach their own school's students well.

Being paid so high salary, there is no reason for current school teachers to moonlight as private tutors.

Moreover, by holding moonlighting jobs, teachers are in position of conflicts whether to stay longer time in the school to teach their own students or to devote more time to their own private tuition students.

As such, MOE should prohibit current school teachers from providing tuition service.

Anonymous said...

Everyone is gonna wait to sell their HDB flat for one million or as highly inflated price dey can to foreign investors den retire comfortably at Malaysia or other countries with low cost of living... And they call it "public" housing... Why bother thinking about the next generation or future ones... Meritocracy baby... Government don't care... They only care about money money money... ;p

Anonymous said...

Anon 19:52,

Like that, who is going to join teaching. Most rank file teachers do not earn that much.

Who are earning that much? Subject heads, HODS and above.

SH: $6600
HOD: $7700
VP: $9500
Principal: $12 000

The teacher in the classroom with full-time teaching, CCA, Committees, remedials, trainings, workshops, project work, marking, national exam duties, disciplining, meeting parents, events manager, departmental duties, administrative paper work, counselling, moral education, lifeskill, national exam invigilation and examination, etc. gets

PEANUTS: $3 700 before cutting CPF.

That's reality. That's why you have a yahoo article recently that asked: Are Singapore Teachers overworked?

THis is even the tip of the iceberg as ranking and politics in rife in MOE schools.

Anonymous said...

"Not every new citizen is going to vote blindly." ANON: 4/10/12 19:34

A $1,000 New Citizenship bonus in 2016 will fix any problem.
Tio bo?

Old citizens cost even less.
Maybe a token $500 Old Citizenship Bonus.
Since old citizens already compensated by the high HDB prices.
Will sure continue to support PAP to maintain the high property prices.
Tio bo?

Not happy?
Continue to blog lah.

Anonymous said...

National Conversation is going in a familiar circle ... but so are you!!!

Are you still waiting for Obama or Cow to solve all the problems?


Even Ravi Philemon has joined NSP. Time for you to stand up and be counted Mr Lucky?

Anonymous said...

Alternative parties are unable to take over anytime soon.
Not even after 2016.

So, the strategy is:

A) extract as much concessions as possible from them now

B) Expose their failings

C) Expose their incompetence

This will erode their dominance and prepare the ground for alternative parties to take over, or best case scenario is coalition Gov.

The end game is not to kill off the PAP but to defang them and neuter them. They do have their uses.. we must learn to harness them, ride them, use them as bullock carts.

Do not be daft.

Anonymous said...

"... we must learn to harness them, ride them, use them as bullock carts."

Dream on asshole. This bullock cart is being very well paid for his trouble, failings and incompetence. And I don't even have to compete with the new imports/talents. Membership has its privileges. You cannot muster the votes even if you life depended on it.

Even if you win a GRC, you won't be able to run the amenities and services. You win 3 GRCs, you will alienate all your voters in the first month when the rubbish starts to pile up. Then we'll see who will be exposed as incompetent.
You seriously think KJ and the RP have the capability to run a town council? You think Singaporeans so stupid?

Minghui Kuok said...

Well, if Tin Pei Ling is determined to sing a tune against the Gov stance, she might not be the MP now. I've seen through some of the articles before and it seems that:
1. The Gov is trying to save some face over failures they know about deep down inside. If not, then Tin Pei Ling wouldn't even be half as daring.

2. It's very likely that despite PM Lee's words that he's his own man, everyone more or less are still living under the Lee Kuan Yew shadow/stigma. Reactions seen so far from ministers like Shanmugam and Tharman seemed to reinforce this point. Needless to say, younger ministers like Chan Chun Sing and Tan Chuan Jin are no exception to the rule as well.

Yet on the positivity of the education overhaul, I'll have to agree with Lucky that Heng Swee Kiat is doing something really serious in business. Teo Chee Hean had made the system gone static mode last time round, so it remains to be seen how far the current MOE can go within the next few years.

On the bus drivers issue, the most depressing point is a recent article on SBS where an accident actually became a ball game kicked back and forth. This is not me going anti-foreigner because the driver might be a local for all we know. What truly spooked me is that if a PTO can engage itself into a pointless fight over a CCTV footage, then it really speaks a lot on the depressing stats. Lui Tuck Yew better shape things up far more drastically.

Anonymous said...

National Conversation? What conversation?

This is the reason why we need foreigners. Demoralisation and Destabilisation to create a new Singapore normal.

Connect the dots.

Anonymous said...

Why people keep mentioning about 2016 vote them out ? think this will happen ? Singaporean Fear !Also the increasing number of Local Born Singaporean Vs Foreign Migrants becoming Singaporean ?
My feel is 2011 just over, remember the sentiments? Even Potong Pasir regain by PAP. Dear friends, that is it, PAP forever, until our dear Mr Lee Kuan Yew no more around and then if the party disunited .... um ... like ex-Foreign Minister, Mr George Lee leads his own party .... Well, Man Do Heaven See. Live our own life to the fullest, be healthy and happy, most of the time, most events are just "wayang"

New Singapore Citizen said...

I don't a difference between Lucy tan and the PAP really. When you suggest to LT to join politics, he ignores all the posters' remarks for some reason.

He listens to what he wants. IN this sense, he cherry picks just like the PAP.

I would consider Tan Kin Lian, a least, at making a difference. It's simple. these individuals are taking steps to air their views. but LT does it stealthily.

Anonymous said...

"You seriously think KJ and the RP have the capability to run a town council?"
Anon 4/10/12 23:05

I would not think so. And I think I am not alone. Majority, perhaps 60%, also think so.

That's why if I were PAP, I am not worried at all come 2016 or even 2021. At least 60% votes for PAP again for sure.

I only worry if foreigners, good or lousy, rich or poor, don't want to come to Singapore anymore, and not worry whether PAP will not win big again.

Anonymous said...

Not just KJ, even Tan Jee Say and the scholar couple were also rejected by at least 60% voters in GE 2011. I bet had Lucky Tan contested, he would have been rejected as well.

And I think if Chen Show Mao had not been in Aljunied GRC with Low Thia Kiang team in GE 2011, he would have also been rejected as well.

People say GRC is unfair to oppposition but except Hougang, the opposition also could not even win another SMC!

The main reason for the failure is the opposition is not united, too many generals but not enough soldiers.

Learn from PAP. Learn from LKY how PAP is so strong and united even under his son LHL.

Anonymous said...

If I were PAP, I will truly worry if the opposition become united under KJ, Tan Jee Say, Chen Show Mao, the scholar couple, Low Thia Kiang or even Lucky Tan and contest 100% seats under one party.

But possible or not, you say lah?

I would say 93% chance not possible. Not even in 2021. Even forever.

Anonymous said...

I still say and believe that the strategy of using the PAP to further our cause is a good one.

Extract more concessions from them
such as:

No GST for basic food stuff
No more petrol taxes
No more sanitary fees

More places for citizens in Uni
Increase in CPF interest
Release of CPF at 55
More newspaper licenses

Such things should be pushed now.
They may give they may not.
The point is that they will have to attend to it.

Use the crack now that is showing
Less work for the opposition parties to do when they get in

Use the PAP for our benefit.

Is it possible? YES.

It will be slow but you and I will prepare the ground for the next generation.

Use them as bullock carts to do all the heavy lifting.. after all, it was they who placed the heaviest stones in the first place.

Why should we be the ones to remove them??

Daemonic said...


"come from countries where the cost of living is just a fraction of Singapore’s". Yup, totally agreed. Freedom of competition is not free if there is no free mobility of labor or people. So we should send our families and dependents to 3rd world countries like Philippines and Indonesia to live and be educated. In Bali, the average monthly income of USD$100 is sufficient to feed a family of 4. Our family can then stay in huge houses, eat good food and enjoy life at a much slower pace at a fraction of the cost.

But wait! Our govt will be very upset then. The shopping malls, HDB flats, our schools and MRTs will be empty. This will cause a sharp drop in tax revenue and then our Ministers will not get their >6 months bonuses even their million dollar salaries will be unsustainable. No way can they allow such things to happen.

So foreigners coming into Singapore is OK but Singaporeans going out should be labeled as "traitors of the motherland" and be stripped of their citizenship!

Anonymous said...

The hokkien says it best...Sin is good to see but not good to eat.

Anonymous said...

Sad truth is...the successful people are not love and respected by A LOT of people.

A wayang society basically.

Anonymous said...

"You seriously think KJ and the RP have the capability to run a town council?"

I agree. KJ can talk all he wants about our funny, constantly revised Singapore reserves numbers.
But he needs to demonstrate he has the operational capability to run a town council before GE 2011. Otherwise, he will unlikely win the GRC or SMC elections.

But how can KJ demonstrate operational capability if he never wins a GRC or SMC?
That my friends is the clever Catch 22 circular argument that Opposition parties will always lose. And why PAP will always win.

KJ's only hope is for the ruling government to centralize e.g. all the garbage collection services as part of a service provided by the government, at the national level. So that he does not have to devote his scarce manpower resources to such mundane issues as garbage disposal.

And why would the PAP government ever want to centralize and take over the garbage disposal at national level? After all, it was the PAP government that cleverly decentralized the garbage disposal function in the first place?

Anonymous said...

So what is the question now?
What are the political party affiliations of the CEOs and directors of all the garbage disposal companies?

Must they declare their political party affiliations before a tender exercise?

Anonymous said...

Is this why we over educate all our talented scholars?
Is this why we "groom" all our scholars?

So that they will be so unexposed to real life that they can never do anything practical like run a garbage disposal operation and be a threat to the PAP government?

Anonymous said...

You ever wonder why Singaporeans don't like their pictures to be taken whereas our neighboring countries are generally friendlier or dont mind to have their pictures taken?

Malaysia boleh!

Anonymous said...

The kampong spirit is across the causeway. The kiampar spirit is here

Anonymous said...

In our meritocracy, it is in the nature of things that only the higher mortals at the apex deserve the entitlement to their million dollar salaries, while the rest of the lower mortals deserve their lot in life to slog out for the benefit of the higher mortals. So it is also a nataral progression in the scheme of things that the gap in wealth between elites and the great unwashed gets wider as GDP goes higher. This is the system that we must preserve and not discuss, NatCon not withstanding, lest the entitlements to the higher mortals get to be redistributed to the underserving, unwashed, underachieving, daft citizens slogging to sustain the system. And since it is the immigrants boosting the GDP numbers, the daft citizens naturally should not stand to benefit, except for the 'wise ones' who make the policies to boost GDP with immigrants. Of course the daft citizens will regret and repent if they do not vote for the same 'wise ones' to remain in power to maintain the status quo as the alternative is worse, like having to slave away not at home, but in neighbouring countries as maids or hookers.

Lucky has pointed out the PM's mindset, the same mindset that led a 17 year old girl to "get out of my elite face". Now that we understand the onerous work that the PM has, he should deserve his millions. What do you think?


Anonymous said...

Now that we understand the onerous work that the PM has, he should deserve his millions. What do you think?


5/10/12 12:06

Of course he deserve his millions lah.

You can win 60% votes and 93% seats or not? If you can, you also deserve your millions lah. Simple as that.

Anonymous said...

Looks good on the outside full of germs on the inside

Anonymous said...

Only our PAP leaders have a sense a entitlement in Singapore - they feel they are entitled to the highest salaries in the world for the same job.
The citizens only expect our leaders to make the wages comparable to other developed countries with comparable cost of living as Singapore.

Anonymous said...

"The citizens only expect our leaders to..."
Anon 5/10/12 12:33

Don't expect or depend too much from your PAP leaders or whoever.

Expect from yourself. Expect yourself to be rich or at least be happy and satisfied. If cannot in Singapore, then go elsewhere for it.

If you cannot, blame yourself.

Anonymous said...

Wages here, like so many other aspects of our lives, are distorted by fiat government policies. In some ways, it is the government's way of telling us they are worth the millions they are paid because they are "doing the right thing" vs other governments and civil service around the world. The distorsions from a free market would be acceptable if the international statistics on income inequality and real income growth of the lowest half of the country bear out their claims of being a first world government. Not only are these statistics showing we are bottom of the pack, but the policies are becoming more extreme. The fact the PM made his condemnation of Singaporeans sense of entitlement in a right wing newspaper (The Australian) tells alot about the turn they have taken after GE 2011 - be prepared for a rough ride those at the bottom.

Anonymous said...

"His disdainful view of Singaporeans who have suffered due to his policies and are not doing well "feel that they should get an entitlement" says a lot about what he thinks of ordinary Singaporeans and their struggles."

Now I finally understand why I cannot get back my CPF. They are entitled to risk my CPF for their bonuses and he thinks I am not entitled to get back my hard earned money to spend as I like because a part of it was contributed by my employers. He probably thinks that he, as the son of LKY, is entitled to his salary paid from taxes while I, who never did well enough in school, do not deserve my pay for productive work that my employers paid me.

Anonymous said...

Does your CPF money belong to you?

If yes, then why must you pay interest for "borrowing" money from yourself?

If yes, then why can't you use CPF money anyway you want, when you want to?

Anonymous said...

It is sad to hear of cases of Singaporeans working as bus drivers, cleaners, dish-washers, etc working very long hours yet having their wages depressed due to competition caused by the massive influx of even cheaper foreign workers.
The government have been instrumental in causing the ever rising rental cost many SMEs have to bear and allowing our island to be flooded by foreigners almost equal in number to the local Singaporeans. Both measures have in some way depress the wages of the low-skill Singaporean workers
It makes me wonder what is the point of having a union and a government who is only interested in generating revenue for their coffers but is so uncaring as to do nothing to alleviate the hardships faced by citizens at the bottom.
The saddest thing that seems to happen to Singaporeans, due to perpetual conditioning by our beloved leaders and media, is not to harbor any hope of PAP ever doing any thing good to improve life of its citizens.

Anonymous said...

"It makes me wonder what is the point of having a union and a government who is only interested in generating revenue for their coffers but is so uncaring as to do nothing to alleviate the hardships faced by citizens at the bottom."
Anon 5/10/12 15:33

Citizens at the bottom got vote for PAP or not?

If yes, good for PAP lah.

If no, also doesn't matter, only 40% what.

So what matters is 60% voted for PAP to make PAP win.

Make 60% vote for you and you will also win. Boleh?

Anonymous said...

How can you conduct national conversation with people who think they are right and you wrong?

How can you ever talk to people who pretend to listen and giver you three lines reply when you have written pages?

How can one man or a few represent teens of thousands of people?

Basically, how do you reason with idiotic people?

As you have an idiot(only a mad person will do the job) to run a church, with many idiotic educated supporters to keep them in power, you will find this model being replicated in politics.

Anonymous said...

The key is votes.
Do you know how to get more votes for your political party?
If you don't know.
Then bo pian lor.
Just hang around here with the other losers and complain.
While PAP continues to win with 60%.
And continue to reward themselves with high salaries.

To the winners go the spoils.
To the losers, more competition with foreign talents.

Anonymous said...

You can write for another ten years lucky, stupid people means stupid people

Anonymous said...

National Conversation = pap Indoctrination.

Anonymous said...

""It makes me wonder what is the point of having a union and a government who is only interested in generating revenue for their coffers"

That is the point of wayang. The union is there for the sake of union, and not that it really serve a purpose other to serve the PAP. So next time , anyone question PAP whether SINCITY is the first world, PAP can make stupid reply like "Yes, of course we are. We even have union to fight for the workers." We know how the world and naive singaporeans are gullible to believe the SInful PAP.

Anonymous said...

We have a world class sporting hub and the world's biggest dome in one of the worst locally produced sport talents' cities in the world.

No talent but great gears.

Anonymous said...

For F**k's sake.
We are not a sporting nation like USA, UK, Australia or South Africa.

The list of Singapore sporting greats is as long as our list of gentleman Prime Ministers.

Anonymous said...

Minister salaries are beyond world class. It is "Out of this world" class.

Besides Singapore, which junior minister in which country is paid a million dollar salary a year and yet can win 60% majority votes every election?

Anonymous said...

Whatever class lah, sporting nation or not, or whatever or whoever.

All these would not have been possible without at least 60% majority votes for PAP every election.

And all because the opposition, and despite elections, cannot grow big and strong but remain stunted for 47 years! Can you imagine?

Anonymous said...

Why the opposition cannot have one "LKY" who can be feared and respected and unite all of them to contest 100% of seats as one party against PAP and their famous LKY?

Why the opposition have so many "half past six" mini LKYs? Like that how to expect 60% voters to vote for them like they did for PAP?

Sure lose one what, tio bo?

Anonymous said...

Too many generals or too many people suck up to generals or winners.

Anonymous said...

The lowly rules!

Tokyo Singaporean said...

The way I see is that the situation in Singapore is bleak. When a country needs to go down the path of earning money from gambling addicts in order to survive, we're in difficult times. When inflation is increasing at an average of 5% every 3 months, we need to take stock.

I agree with some of the above commenters who mentioned that you can't rationalize with a citizenry that has been conditioned and demoralised to venture a possibility of an open society where Singaporeans are not short-changed as citizens of a nationn, in particular, Singaporeans serve National Service. Yet, the sort of welfare a Singaporean citizen gets is one where taxi drivers can only be Singaporeans.

You can't change Singapore and the people are heavily conditioned. You can only appeal to the youngster who are waking up to the fact that they would end up pretty much like their dads if they keep supporting marginalising policies.

Many people in Singapore are apathetic and have given up the good fight. They know that the situation is hopeless and the best way forward is to game the system. Singaporeans join grassroots and resident committees because they have their own personal agendas such as having access to flat selection, primary one registration, free parking, etc..

Tokyo Singaporean said...

...Singaporeans are a divided lot and Tan Cheng Bock concurs on this. With more foreigners and new citizens flooding this island, the Singaporean consciousness has been diluted and most Singaporeans don't really care much about it as long as it doesn't personally inflict them in their own backyards.

Even notions of human rights are now under attack in Singapore under the banner of "a sense of entitlement". The government is engaging in word contamination and is now attempting to cloud clarity on what it means to be a human being and a citizen in the country. Welfare has become a dirty word in Singapore.

I see no way out for Singapore. Even the civil service in Singapore runs on divide and conquer ranking and assessment of its officers. Most appointments in Singapore is based on "who you know" and meritocracy is only about 30%. 70% is how closely affliated one is to the ruling party.

Future Singaporeans will be inheriting a pressure cooker society where harsh Darwinian laws of survival is drummed into the citizenry year in and year out.

While this is happening, ministers are busy buying and building 2 houses overseas for retirement. The rule for purchasing of a HDB flat of owning properties overseas does not apply to the very ministers who crafted these rulings.

In fact, ex-minister Mah Bow Tan doesn't need to justify his HDB mispolicies right now as he is retiring in Australia in his house and the best bit of the Singapore system is that our income is being taxed each month to pay for his pension each month.

I agree with those posters who propound that Singaporeans find work overseas. It's best not to waste time and regret later in life that one has sacrificed themselves for city state that doesn't value its own people.

As such, I agree much with what Alfian Sa'at wrote on Zing ( sometime back:

"So many of the comments to this letter exhort the letter writer to stick around in Singapore and work towards changing things for the better. When I was 20, I also thought the same thing–one day there will be a groundswell of change, one day grips will be loosened and there will be a chance to breathe. But now I understand that was all delusion. One step forward, two steps back. The bruising games. I say to the writer now, please, if you have the chance, just go. Don’t let anyone try to emotionally blackmail you to stay around–because of their fears that your leaving will become an indictment of *them*. Don’t let Singapore leech you dry and yet call *you* the parasitic ingrate. Don’t let Singapore toy with your hopes. Don’t let Singapore murder your dreams. Just go. With the blessedness of the less deceived."

Thank you for writing, LT.


Anonymous said...

Time to wash dirty feet

Anonymous said...

Don't improve things. Let it rot and kill more people. Why? They smart mah...

Anonymous said...

Yes, I do not see how anyone in Singapore have the will or passion to "fight" the system or to "contribute" to a better place.

We have our own selfish reasons, agendas such as ensuring a place in school for the kids, a retirement job as a RC member or even as a preferred applicant for housing or hawker stall. Although we get to pay the same price, we get first priority.

Those with the means have already prepared a nest to flee. Those who dont will be stuck to provide menial, tedious support for the influential.

I would encourage anyone particularly the younger ones to up and go. Seek your adventures elsewhere... you can always return as a foreign talent.. but only for a visit and contract period.

Break Free

Anonymous said...

Die overseas alo good hor

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Don't improve things. Let it rot and kill more people. Why? They smart mah...

6/10/12 13:56

ya lor...if they not smart...why pay them so much?...since they smart...they solve it lor

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Anonymous said...

I concur with TokyoSingaporean. You need to align yourself with the establishment values if you are to stay on in Singapore, LT. It's just the way things are. People only wake up when they're in the mid 50s. By that time, it's too late to even disagree. Personally, I'm working overseas and hoping to get a PR where I am here.

Anonymous said...

I concur with TokyoSingaporean. You need to align yourself with the establishment values if you are to stay on in Singapore, LT. It's just the way things are. People only wake up when they're in the mid 50s. By that time, it's too late to even disagree. Personally, I'm working overseas and hoping to get a PR where I am here.

Anonymous said...

PAP policies may be no good but at least it makes 60% rich, or happy and satisfied. Doesn't matter include new citizens or not, as long as it is 60%, it is good enough.

That's why PAP govt is so strong (93% seats in Parliament)and Singapore is so peaceful and prosperous. At least on the surface.

Govts in other countries should learn from PAP govt. Then their countries will also look peaceful and prosperous like Singapore.

If they don't want to learn, there may be protests and even revolts against their govt, as already happened in some.

Anonymous said...

If the north Koreans get to vote, their leader will get at least 90% approval.

Anonymous said...

60% voted PAP.
They cannot be wrong.

So eat shit.
10 billion flies also cannot be wrong.

Anonymous said...

"10 billion flies also cannot be wrong."
Anon 7/10/12 13:15

Learn from PAP, not flies, you retard!

Anonymous said...

Houseflies have been around for about 65 million years.
The first PAPie has been around for only about 60 years.
Not even sure if PAP can survive beyond GE 2016.

So PAP has a lot to learn from houseflies.
And even more from pigs & cockroaches.
But that's another story.

Anonymous said...

"Yes, we can!"
President Obama,
leader of the most powerful country in the world,
NOT the highest paid political leader in the world.

"Managing expectations a key challenge."
PM Lee,
leeder of one of the smallest country in the world,
most highly paid political leader in the world.

Paid so much to deliver so leetle (little?).,-says-PM-Lee

Anonymous said...

No point having national conversation with government people.

They have itching ears, worse than monkeys

Anonymous said...

In GE 2011, there's one key factorsin my humble opinion why the PAP still holds 60% and most of the seats. It came from my parents too, cause they were the ones who told me to vote for PAP to which I did not. Singapore has more elderly citizens, these elders still hold loyalty while being blind to modern social media, unaware of the outside world while still thankful for the changes PAP had done for Singapore a long time ago.

GE 2016 is where we either stand up to get what is right. They claim that the proposal to raise pay for 1500 and below by 30% over 3 to 5 years would not raise our productivity, yet their millionaire pay is easily accepted by their own. They claim we feel entitled, and yet they entitle themselves to that pay.

I'll be honest, I feel entitled, I feel that I am entitled to speak my mind because this is democracy, I feel I am entitled to the government doing something to help us the citizens because WE ARE citizens, WE are the heartbeat that is Singapore. We are the ones in the frontlines slogging our lives for the country's growth. Dare they sit in their high thrones and use that against us.

Anonymous said...

" ... that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain
—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom
—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

Abraham Lincoln,
Gettysburg Address

Anonymous said...

You are given a choice between a rotten apple and a very rotten apple, which do you choose?

Obviously the rotten apple will get more votes lah

Anonymous said...

The choice is actually between a
real apple versus wayang apple.
Vote Opposition.
The choice is clear.

Say No to Fakes!

Anonymous said...

Ok, the choice is between a hypocritical deluded apple and a deluded apple. People chose the sheen of hypocrisy over the deluded apple because they believe in cosmetics.

Anonymous said...

At least we agree about the hypocrisy of the Pro Alien Party.
But only the Pro Alien Party is deluded.

"You can fool some of the people all the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time."
Abraham Lincoln

Anonymous said...

How leetle they had worked is not the problem.
The problen was they still got elected after so many khaw peh khaw boo everywhere.

Whose fault? PAP?

The people must be hypocrites to say the leasst. They deserve to be fried.

Anonymous said...

True. People are hypocrites that's why blind hypocrites follow blind hypocrites saying is true.

Anonymous said...

As a Singaporean in my late 40s I have given up hope for the future of my only son who is 18 now. He is not a elite or gifted student and neither am I rich. I fear for his future and if Singaporeans do not realise that soon than so be it. As for my son I am preparing him for a future away from Singapore.

Anonymous said...

In order to train your son for a future away from S'pore.
First you must train him to vote Opposition.
Next, you must teach your son to also convince his friends to vote Opposition.

The best training period is just before NS.
During NS, he will see how the elites are treated versus how he is treated.

Anonymous said...

Look across the causeway. The kampong beckons!

Anonymous said...

For our government, they don't have a sense of concern for others well-being except their own personal self-interests.

Anonymous said...

For our government, they don't have a sense of concern for others well-being except their own personal self-interests.
Anon 8/10/12 19:47

If that is so, 60% would not have voted for them and which got them 93% seats in Parliament to be not just government, but a strong government.

Anonymous said...


Indeed! It is time for Sinkies to come clean with themselves.
Too many are instigating others to vote oppositions but voted otherwise themselves.

Sinkies deserve the leeders they have chosen.

Anonymous said...

Many people still have not understood why at least 60% voted for PAP every election.

Or know how to go about winning over the 60% from the PAP.

Or maybe they know but got no incentive, motivation, courage or whatever lah to do it.

Anonymous said...

The smart ones know how to have a good life under the PAP.

Or if they cannot, they will emigrate to other countries for a better life.

So why bother to fight PAP to win over the 60% from PAP, tio bo?

So let those who do not have a good life cow peh cow bu lah, which is of no use. Not smart is like that what, what to do?

Anonymous said...

When you see a white pig and a black cobra.
You must kill the white pig first.
A black cobra kills only one person.
A white pig can destroy the hopes of an entire generation of young Singaporeans.

Anonymous said...

Funny thing is....we are trying to keep this that allowed...if you say this or write that....blah blah blah consequences would to have national conversation?

No wonder our people talk like constipation and england so otah

Anonymous said...

And people wondering why Singaporeans are very poor in relating with each other....of course this gotta FAKE IT...fake it in the like fake it people?

Anonymous said...

Also fake it in politics.

Anonymous said...

After 47 years of being ruled by THE PAP, Singaporeans do not have an image of what being free means. Singapore do nothave an image of what it means to live in country were they can speak freely and honestly.

Singapore is a zoo and Singaporeas are animals that are well-trained. The zookeeper has trained them well. As such, Singaporeans are not STRONG.

Anonymous said...

"And people wondering why Singaporeans are very poor in relating with each other....of course this gotta FAKE IT...fake it in the like fake it people? "

This is by far the best observation any blogger has made about Singapore and Singapoeans.

A large part of our day to day communication has been contaminated (borrowed from TokyoSingaporean) with "fake it" gestures. Singaporeans play a role in schools and the in the work place. How can Singaporeans be happy? Only the government is happy. Why not? Guess who are the richest politicians on planet Earth?

Anonymous said...

The funny thing is;
the zoo keepers (the MIWs) have now started to think that the wayang country they have created is real.
The zoo keepers are now unable to separate wayang from reality anymore.

1.Wayang to Prince William. Thinking he can be as easily fooled as Sinkies.

2.Wayang in the non-partisan NatCON. Between 15-35 people out of a total audience of 50 have been identified as PAP members.

3.The Singapore zoo keepers (politicians) seriously believe their work in tiny Singapore should be more highly paid than the American President.

Truly pathetic when you start to believe in your own bullshit.

Anonymous said...

Sinkies indeed bullshit amongst themselves and believe in each others.
They also blame everyone else except him or herself.
Yes, they asked to be boiled.

Anonymous said...

Can't comment on fucking noises by certain ppl or be accused of the most heinous crime in this city ... r-----

Because of a non fake comment....the real cause or instigator was all forgotten and the hypocrites turned the situation and took the moral high ground to browbeat non fake people

Non fake people are forced to turn and be fake it people like the rest or lose rice bowl

No wonder all so fakingly nice. All the accomplishment, like the Olympic bronze, fakingly achieved too?

Anonymous said...

One much hate and vitriol from righteous operas also dont have so much soap

Anonymous said...

Know when and what to be real and when and what to wayang (or soap opera or fake or whatever lah).

Get this right and you will get money and not trouble, tio bo?

Anonymous said...

"Get this right and you will get money and not trouble, tio bo?"
Anon 9/10/12 11:36

Sibeh tio. Nothing is more tio than this.

Anonymous said...



Anonymous said...

Yes, we serve money. Confirm, double and triple confirm! tio bo?

Anonymous said...

Instigators that do not show themselves got to be exposed.

Anonymous said...

Look who's talking? One who questions instigation is adding to instigation. Bloody moron.

Anonymous said...

poke the wrong hole and you may be buried in shit. poke the right hole and it can be pleasurable.

poke it right. poke your way to success!

Anonymous said...

It is normal to have conversation within the Family.

Anonymous said...

Family is very big, not 4 or 5 but more than a million! In percentage terms, it is 60.1%.

And Family is very united and strong for 47 years because nobody can split the Family.

Anonymous said...

Vote Opposition.
Start a National Conversation in Parliament in 2016.

Anonymous said...

Dun give up on the 60% 'daft' Singaporeans.
As people age, housing over-priced and Ministers and PM exposing themselves in more tok cok via the Singapore Con, expect more people to question their motives and eventual major downfall of various GrcS WITH mINISTERS IN THEM WHO WILL BE 'SACKED' by the voters for tok cok but no action.

Anonymous said...

Sack every good for nothing Minister who are not up to the mark in performance in the next election.(All wayang cannot be counted as performance).

If the average Singaporean life do not improve, SACK THE PAP

auto said...

Singaporeans have no choice but to accept them for the time being until the reserve is back on track. I believe just like other pension funds in the world that has suffered, the reserve is not spared. At least PAP is doing what they can to put money back to the reserve unlike those in EU, only talks but no drastic action or implementing counter productive action such as tax increase.

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